coup de grace hey, great blog. your summary of "those years" was pretty good. as i'm sure you know, different chileans have differing opinions on what happened during those years, but i'd like to throw in my two pesos if i could. one thing that often gets overlooked is that a majority (not just a plurality, but a majority) of chileans wanted and were in favor of the coup. this does not mean they condoned the excesses of the military once they took power (most people didn't expect the detentions and tortures since the military had generally steered clear of politics and interfering with civil society) but most people were tired of the chaos, disorder, and economic problems at the time around the coup. of course, many regretted supporting the coup once they realized what they'd gotten themselves into. the intresting thing is that despite the atrocities of the pinochet regime, less people were killed in those 17yrs than in any other dictatorship in latin america, at around 3200. argentina killed 30k in just 7yrs (i've never seen the 50k figure, it seems exaggerated), brazil about 100k, guatemala over 250k) yet it seems pinochet is often cited as the worse. i'm no right winger (in chilean elections i vote socialist) but i wonder why his is singled out. also, 90% of the killings and the tortures happened in the first 4yrs of his government. tortures and killings went on after '77 to be sure, but to a much lesser degree. as you probably know, politically chile is divided into thirds (1/3 "left wing", 1/3 "right wing", 1/3 somewhere in between, allende having won just 36% of the vote, so he never really had a "mandate" so to speak). i think a lot of chileans struggle with pinochet's legacy. on the one hand there are all the human rights violations and repression. on the other, he set up base of the economic system that has helped chileans to prosper. despite complaints on the part of many chileans (if you haven't noticed, chileans love to complain and are a pretty negative people at times) everyone, even the poorest of the poor, are better off now than they were 20yrs ago and that they would've been under a different economic system. of course, the concertación governments have tweaked the system to support health, education, and social programs that pinochet ignored, but they're doing this under an extremely capitalist system. ¿would chile's relative prosperity have been possible under a democratic government? i think it's hard to say, since in a democratic system, there would have been fierce opposition to the harch economic measures needed to turn an economy from a socialist protectionist economy to a free market capitalist one (germany, japan, korea, taiwan, singapore, spain, now china--all of them laid the foundations for their prosperous economies under dictatorships or heavy handed undemocratic regimes). anyway, just thought i'd throw out some food for thought. sorry if it's long. enjoy the rest of your time in chile (and yes, chileans act as if winter didn't come every year and complain about it, even though many chileans are "proud" of the fact that they live in a "cold" climate and that makes them different and "better" than the happy go-lucky "tropical" latinos ;)). cheers!
shamoo the pig Hon! I am soooo glad you are having the time of your life. I love the blog and am so happy you have a "forever record" of your trips. Thanks you so much for the bracelet - I love it!!! Think of you all the time. Tell Zach , hi.
Love,
AD
james st. james
non-member comment
coup de grace
hey, great blog. your summary of "those years" was pretty good. as i'm sure you know, different chileans have differing opinions on what happened during those years, but i'd like to throw in my two pesos if i could. one thing that often gets overlooked is that a majority (not just a plurality, but a majority) of chileans wanted and were in favor of the coup. this does not mean they condoned the excesses of the military once they took power (most people didn't expect the detentions and tortures since the military had generally steered clear of politics and interfering with civil society) but most people were tired of the chaos, disorder, and economic problems at the time around the coup. of course, many regretted supporting the coup once they realized what they'd gotten themselves into. the intresting thing is that despite the atrocities of the pinochet regime, less people were killed in those 17yrs than in any other dictatorship in latin america, at around 3200. argentina killed 30k in just 7yrs (i've never seen the 50k figure, it seems exaggerated), brazil about 100k, guatemala over 250k) yet it seems pinochet is often cited as the worse. i'm no right winger (in chilean elections i vote socialist) but i wonder why his is singled out. also, 90% of the killings and the tortures happened in the first 4yrs of his government. tortures and killings went on after '77 to be sure, but to a much lesser degree. as you probably know, politically chile is divided into thirds (1/3 "left wing", 1/3 "right wing", 1/3 somewhere in between, allende having won just 36% of the vote, so he never really had a "mandate" so to speak). i think a lot of chileans struggle with pinochet's legacy. on the one hand there are all the human rights violations and repression. on the other, he set up base of the economic system that has helped chileans to prosper. despite complaints on the part of many chileans (if you haven't noticed, chileans love to complain and are a pretty negative people at times) everyone, even the poorest of the poor, are better off now than they were 20yrs ago and that they would've been under a different economic system. of course, the concertación governments have tweaked the system to support health, education, and social programs that pinochet ignored, but they're doing this under an extremely capitalist system. ¿would chile's relative prosperity have been possible under a democratic government? i think it's hard to say, since in a democratic system, there would have been fierce opposition to the harch economic measures needed to turn an economy from a socialist protectionist economy to a free market capitalist one (germany, japan, korea, taiwan, singapore, spain, now china--all of them laid the foundations for their prosperous economies under dictatorships or heavy handed undemocratic regimes). anyway, just thought i'd throw out some food for thought. sorry if it's long. enjoy the rest of your time in chile (and yes, chileans act as if winter didn't come every year and complain about it, even though many chileans are "proud" of the fact that they live in a "cold" climate and that makes them different and "better" than the happy go-lucky "tropical" latinos ;)). cheers!