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| 30th September 2008 Lama Jinpa | Stupidity - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Yes, there is no excuse, other than pure self-centered ignorance, for disrespecting ANY other culture, especially the religious and sacred traditions of a country. This material should be taken off the internet...But of course that wont happen, as the deeply pathological individual who posted will never likely have that kind of realization... One can hope of course, for the nearly impossible... |
| 21st September 2008 Wm. Webb | Provincial Thought - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Those who are offended by jhator, along with those put too much importance on it, are both deluded. To Tibetan Buddhists, the body is unnecessary after death, when the (soul) has departed. To dispose of it in a way that is not consistent with a respect for still-living beings would be wrong. Tibet is a country nearly devoid of ground suitable for burial, and the same is true of fuel that could be used for cremation. Giving the body back to living creatures who can use it is respectful both to the person who has died and to all living things. From a practical standpoint, it also solves a fairly serious health problem. Westerners, with our morbid preoccupation with death and our quaint ideas about resurrection, find this sort of thing disgusting, but consideration in a respectful, thoughtful way will reveal to most that it is, indeed, far more sensible than destroying a body's integrity with chemicals and sealing it in a container. There is a movement in the US and Great Britain toward natural burial in burial "parks," to allow the constituents of the body to return to the earth and nourish its beings. That, to me, is true reverence. So is jhator. It is the common Western practices that are barbaric. |
| 13th September 2008 c moore | - From: Tibetan sky burial in China it never ceases to amaze me the difference in our cultures. I see nothing wrong with you posting these pictures. First I've heard of this. Thanks for the education. |
| 4th September 2008 kathy | Photos - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I think you were perfectly correct in the photos you choose to post. I didn't see any nude body being ripped apart; the pulverized skeleton was a little disturbing, but no longer recognizable as a person. We all have to remember that at that point the body is just an empty vessel. The vultures looked healthy and beautiful. In the Zorastrian tradition the body is left alone for in a 100 ft tower, called a tower of silence. After time goes by, nature (vultures, ravens etc.) takes it's course. This is still practiced in India, but because of the toxins in many human bodies has lead to a significant decline in the vulture population. The vultures are loved for all their qualities -primarily their patience in waiting and never attacking anything still living. |
| 24th August 2008 Claudia | \"Sky Burial\" Author:Xinran - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I recently finished reading a memoir of a Chinese woman searching for her husband in Tibet for 30 years. It is a very intriguing and "eye opening" read. The title is "Sky Burial" by Xinran. I highly recommend this read of a beautiful and complicated country. |
| 26th June 2008 Simon | Sensativity - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Regardless of the situation, weather you're invited to a ceremony such as this(or wether you intrude) people should be very carefull about how they act. This is a facinating cememony and I was glad to read about it, but is taking photos really needed. How would you feel if a picture of a body of your loved one appeared on a webiste. Tourists/travelers have a very important role to play when it comes to cultural sensativity and I think you've crossed it. |
| 19th June 2008 tsering sonam | thank you. - From: Tibetan sky burial in China you are the man who know about tibet and limi village.tashi delek go head..i will be with you.. |
| 8th June 2008 Eddy | sky burial - From: Tibetan sky burial in China In traditional Tibetan Buddism in Tibet (NOT CHINA BY THE WAY) the sky burial was seen as the last act of absolute charity. Giving your body for others to feed on. In this culture even a worm or a bird could have been your Mother in a previous life and the body is nothing more than a sacred vehicle so giving it as a last act to support others is the ultimate in selflessness. |
| 2nd June 2008 Noelani | Sky burial - From: Tibetan sky burial in China The Tibetan have a unique way of understanding of life and death. Its seems barbaric to most people but they are very practical. Why waste limited land with dead bodies that just get eaten by bugs anyway. Why not give back to nature from where we came right up front. Knowing their loved ones will reincarnate, they have not problem with seeing this body die. It's probably that other cultures do not accept death as a natural process as they do, hence get upset by it. I know cremation is done, but I am not sure if you have to be a monk, enough money for the wood, or what...anyway...there are many cultures with different values and beliefs...good to respect them all. |
| 1st June 2008 Paul Butler | Disapointing - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I'm disapointed that you would choose to photograph and describe (without understanding of meaning) this event. I don't intend to explain to you the significance as it's clear your not interested in understanding but purely to check the 'shock' box on your tour of tibet. Congratulations...... |
| 30th May 2008 Rachel | Just silly.. - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I think it's ridiculous how many people are so upset about these photographs... And whoever claimed this was a case of voyeurism is seriously lacking in vocabulary skills. This is only one man's educational experience and his choice to share the experience with others, which I can appreciate very much. And to bring into the discussion the photographers own family members (asking him if he's ever known someone who died) is the stupidest thing I've heard. These people chose to perform this ritual for their loved one. They do not view death in the same light as most of you condemning the photographer. This is about the deceased individuals wish to give back to nature. The family was obviously aware that photographs were being taken and had no problem with it. So for everyone crying about his disrespect and lack of professionalism... get over yourself. You may not feel comfortable with it and that's your prerogative... But that doesn't at all make you right. |
| 26th May 2008 Eric | A practical rationalization of a necessary sadness. - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Thank you for your sharing on the Tibetan “sky burial”. It is people like you who remove the wall of ignorance and misunderstanding among people. That there are people who react so angrily to your sharing here only serves to unmask the inherent barbarism in the “sky burial” that these people want to hide. Down in their hearts, they know such acts of violence against the human body, whether dead or alive, are revolting to the ordinary people and very hurtful to close relatives. Otherwise, why is there such display of anger? But this does not mean that Tibetans are, by nature, barbaric. They are human beings like all of us and they love and honour their loved ones whether in life or in death. It may be noted that “sky burial” were for the serfs whose lives worth very little. So their bodies could not be worth more when they are dead. “Sky burial” was a manifestation of extreme property in “traditional” Tibetan society and of geographical necessities which made ordinary burial often impractical. Those who can afford the firewood like the Dalai Lamas have their dead bodies cremated. This shows that the often cited religious justification is nothing more than a practical rationalization of a necessary sadness. Mercifully, “sky burial” is not an indispensable Buddhist obligation. So when cremation is widely affordable to the masses in the future and when Tibetans are better informed, such a practice like many others before it will, in time, die a natural death. For those who have a romantic fantasy of “sky burial”, please give some thoughts to the feelings of your loved ones who still love you in death. Anyway, “sky burial” is an oxymoron. You cannot do a burial in the sky. |
| 23rd May 2008 Tibetan | A Tibetan comments - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Hi all, Another Tibetan here to contribute to the discussion. What the writer describes and shared photos of is an important Tibetan custom. Unfortunately, the writer describes what he saw without any appreciation of and sensitivity to local beliefs and philosophy of live. For the Tibetan Buddhist, sacrificing yourself for the sake of others is one of the highest aspirations, and giving your body to the vultures, a lowly being, is act of ultrism even in your death. Also, philosophically, we believe that the body is only physical and impermanent and transitory in nature. The soul is the more important one and it is something that transmigrates to another body upon our death. So attachment to physical aspects of ourselves are discouraged, even while we are living, and definitely, when we die. All that being said, as a Tibetan and I know many Tibetans will agree with me, I think the practice of Sky Burial should end in this time and age. It is too gruesome and does not accord dignity to the deceased and his family (altruistic though it may be). |
| 1st May 2008 Diane | Also witness to sky burial - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Hi. I was also witness to the sky burial, but back in 1984. We were taken at dawn to the site and saw the disposal of 3 bodies in total. They asked that we NOT take photos, although at the end we were able to photograph the vultures. I believe a few years later some journalists photographed the ritual and that caused the ban. I think it is a pragmatic way to dispose of bodies in Tibet. The thing that moved me that most was that a young boy of about 12 years was an 'apprentice' butcher and was helping. That was quite hard to deal with. |
| 28th April 2008 tenzin | from my experience - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I've been to Tibet few times leading US students and seen myself of this holy practice of sky burial. From the surface it seems cruel to see such acts, but if you look deeper through buddhist perspective than it makes so much sense. THis act is the highest form of giving oneself, a final sacrifice - you come to this world with nothing at birth and you leave this world with nothing! The final act of your sacrfice is to give your body to benefit other beings in this case to these special birds - vultures. This teaches people the meaning of impermanence. That one should not hold to material wealth only! I was definitely reminded of this one when i witnessed this ceremony. I saw some Chinese tourists they were very insensitve, they would go right up front to the site, without even asking and start making all these gestures and talking loud while this ceremony was happening. they couldn't keep their mouths shut to show some decency. But regardless, the American HS students that I was with were all so touched by this ceremony that we didn't talk for about 3 hrs after what we had witnessed and later in the evening when we reached Lhasa we discussed of what they had seen in the afternoon and 99% were so thankful to their parents and loved ones.. that they called their parents in the States to say they love them and thanked them!!! Overall, they felt that life is very valuable and sacred. One cannot take it for granted! This is kinda of the effect that one gets when witnessing such a unique tradition of Tibetan culture. Yes Chinese gov't is using this as ways to attract tourists and unfortunately some people still don't understand and some do. This obvisouly is too difficult to understand for the Chinese (occupiers) who have no religious understanding and usually label it as "barbaric" culture. |
| 20th April 2008 sky england | your blog - From: Tibetan sky burial in China really enjoyed educating myself with your posting. read all the comments/opinons on your posting! i also agree with the circle of life/death way of life the tibet people believe and fully respect and admire it (i even feel a little jealous because i am a "ignorant" westerner and probably will be burnt or buried. can't wait.) i think we may have really lost touch with nature as westerners, and enjoyed a slap in the face of purity from your privelged encounter. i will end with What is the meaning of life? To prepare to die. thanks sky |
| 31st March 2008 Heinrich | Reply to Tsering - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I guess most of the Han-Chinese do not mind the Tibetan claim and reserve the right of sky burial, because they will not be able to adapt to this. Only the TIBETAN can have this ritual, this is for sure. As regard to the Panda, you need some time and much efford to try to change the "Chinese Panda" to "Tibetan Panda". Sad, but you can try. |
| 28th March 2008 Dane | contraversary - From: Tibetan sky burial in China What a contrary? if you believe in whatever Good is,you then believe that good gives you live and he also takes it from you. inconsequently you have no right over any parts of your body or soul to control. it is all belong to God. He judges and he decides. |
| 18th March 2008 mystykmike | Awesome - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I love it. Where do I sign up? |
| 17th March 2008 Martin, | unblieveable - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I cann't believe such a in humane action against other human body , human body must be respected though died . It is barbaric act |
| 16th March 2008 G Collis | tibet and china - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Having been to China on a cultural visit I am become quite interested in anything to do with China. Before hand I believe I was a victim of western propaganda and have since been trying to find a blog that gives the view of the Chinese people. I found this site very interesting and am quite amazed at how offensive some people can be especially when they have not read your post properly. Maybe this is the problem with people who have such firm opinions. All I know is that China is about as different to the west as life on Mars would be and I think we should all find out more about it. Well done for educating me. PS. Correct me if I am wrong and without being offensive please but I thought Tibet had been part of China since Kublai Khan. |
| 15th March 2008 Tsering | Tibet land - Chinese claims - From: Tibetan sky burial in China The fact that you claim this burial happened in mainland China and not in Tibet is misleading. Did you know that more than half of ethnic Tibetan territories have been Sino- sized and incorporated into mainland China? Just because the Chinese changed all the Tibetan area names into Chinese does not legalize the occupation. Did you know that the famous “Chinese Panda” bears are ethnically part of traditional Tibetan territory? |
| 14th March 2008 Taty | The meaning - From: Tibetan sky burial in China It is common to be critical of traditions one does not understand. The reason for the sky burial is to help the essence of the person and the family detach from the material form of the corpse since it is no longer the person. It seems strange from a western perspective, but having a corpse of a loved one stuck in box being eaten alive by worms and rotting with bacteria doesn't seem that much better. The body returning to nature is only shocking to those who are afraid of death in a deeper way. |
| 26th February 2008 R Eldar | No need to be so offensive - From: Tibetan sky burial in China If you read the rest of my blog you can see that I have been to Tibet and I understand the suffering and the history of the region. I am not making any arguments about how this region should be called, but it is important to me as a travelblogger that people can use my information for their trips, and since most guidebooks refer to this area as Sichuan I do so too. |
| 23rd February 2008 shane | well done - From: Tibetan sky burial in China i dont normally comment on blogs but i am impressed by the way you have created this site and impressed by the way you have addressed comments - well done. I have been to Litang myself and I have witnessed several sky burials and have photos as a result of being invited to take them, however in other cases i was asked not to take photos and of course did not. your photos are very tasteful and i would be interested in seeing the full collection. again well done. |
| 11th February 2008 Zedex Mohammed | re: legal issues - From: Tibetan sky burial in China i just wanted to say that i have read that sky burials were banned in the 1960s by the communist government but was legalised again in the 1980s so the above comment made by helen can be disregarded [no offence]. i think my opinion of sky burials has allready been written by many of the above commentators, lets just say i think of it in a positive way. |
| 26th January 2008 Topgyal | Lithang and Tibet and China - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I find your argument that Lithang is part of Sichuan historically ignorant. Lithang is part of what the Tibetans refer to as the Kham province of traditional Tibet, most of which was colonised by the Chinese in and after the 18th Century. Is India part of UK? America of UK? Are all the European colonies part of their colonial masters? The only difference between TAR and other Tibetan regions and these decolonised nation-states is that the Chinese still control them! I hope in the future, if you have to travel to Tibet and write/comment about it, that you would be more sensitive to and free from the history written and current reality portrayed by victorious imperialists! |
| 23rd January 2008 wendy Teasdill | way to go - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Thankyou for an interesting set of pictures. Criticisms are based on your naivity but the pictures wouldn't have got here without some sense of going where angels fear to tread. All the comments are raw and instructive, like the sky burial itself. Vultures are sacred birds and don't kill to eat: they need these sky burials, so if the pictures and all the comments together heighten both awareness and respect then that in itself is `Jha-tor'. |
| 22nd January 2008 M | amazing - From: Tibetan sky burial in China i dont find anything distrubing about these pictures and i found the article and pictures very informative. if you had the families permission to take photos i dont see a problem with on the surface it is no different then taking photos of a western funeral its just alittle more eye opening and graphic to us. |
| 5th January 2008 J.L. | - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I have been studying Chinese for two years now after I went on a nine month trip through Asia. The issue of Tibet has always been interesting to me as my city, Santa Fe, has a sizable Tibetan population, and after a visit to Dharamsala, I gained a deep respect for the people and practices of Tibet. I had heard about sky burials from many sources, non of which were from an individual that had ever witnessed one. They all said that pictures were not permitted and outsiders were rarely allowed to observe. That being said, I think this blog is valuable for many reasons. I think it unveils a little about a culture that is popularized but rarely understood. The discussion that resulted provides much of the information and argument that was not present in the blog itself. Thanks for not editing the comments like many of the readers wanted the blog to be edited. |
| 5th December 2007 lhamo | - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I think the big problem and misunderstanding here is that Western attitudes toward death are vastly different from Eastern, especially Tibetan. Most Tibetans are Buddhist, which has a strong focus on the teachings of impermanence, expecially of the body. Tibetans understand that death is a natural and normal thing, inevitable for all of us. In Western society however, we keep our elderly and dying on life support, respirators, all manner of medications, just to stave off death for a little longer, instead of understanding that it is natural and a part of being a human on this planet. We will do anything to avoid death, and even after death, we pump the bodies formerly occupied by our loved ones full of chemicals in order to mimic the appearance of life. Death to a Westerner is something evil, horrible, and ultimately terribly unpleasant- we live in a culture that does everything it can to deny human mortality. To Tibetans, death is very much the opposite, just as natural as birth, and not something to treat as the end of the world. Of course there is grief and sadness involved, but many Tibetans understand the real meaning of death in a way we Westerners can never hope to. When asked what was the meaning of life, the eminient lama Chagdud Tulku Rinpoche replied "to prepare to die," an attitude which many Tibetans share. So, to those people making the comparison between these photos and photos of a Western style funeral, it's really apples to oranges- a different culture, different people, and very different attitude towards the entire concept. |
| 28th November 2007 Pam | Actually... - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I don't see this as any more disgusting than sticking a body in the ground so that it can slowly decompose to become worm food. Sea burials also provide food to the ocean's residents. Why is offering carrion to the vultures such a shocking thing? I think it's rather poignant, to be honest. I'd like to die knowing that my death gave something back to the planet (as fertilizer, as a food source to animals, whatever). Feed me to the birds when I go... that's totally cool with me. I suppose what people find horrifying is the bone crushing -- but I imagine that if they witnessed the full embalming process, they'd be equally appalled. |
| 22nd October 2007 Helen | Legal issues? - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Hi, I want to thank you for a very interesting blog with beautiful pictures! I find your account of the sky burial very interesting. There is just one question that I have regarding your decisions to publish these pictures. One person made a comment that seemed to lose its impact because it was so angry, but it did have one point: apparently, sky burials are illegal in China. Considering this, wouldn't it have been a good idea to cover the face of the man in your picture? Have you considered how to protect the identity of the rest of the family, in case you find a place to publish the rest of your photos? Completely aside from the question of whether or not it is respectful to take/publish these pictures, I think it is probably unlikely that the family who invited you considered all the implications it might have for them if some Chinese official decided to follow up on the story. Since you were invited, you might want to regard it as your duty to protect them from that, by not revealing their identities. Thank you again for a very interesting blog! Helen |
| 19th October 2007 Forest Spryte | Get over yourselves - From: Tibetan sky burial in China To those who are outraged, get over yourselves. He's not making any money off this and is in fact exposing people like us to knowledge not everyone has access to, and what better than photos to do so? A picture's worth 1000 words, but aside from that, he didn't even show anything grisly. When the first live human birth was shown in pictures, people were offended (though people will ALWAYS find SOMETHING to be offended about) but now it's practially accepted as a beautiful, natural thing. If the family didn't care, no harm done. And if you don't like it, close your browser and quit trying to police the Internet with your obviously superior wisdom about what's acceptable and what's not. |
| 10th October 2007 K Petersen | Thanks - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Thanks for posting these. I've read several written accounts of sky burials and have been very curious to see some images. These are the only series I have been able to find, and they are great! |
| 26th September 2007 Travel Bug10 | There are others too - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Sky burial is also done in India by the Zorastrians(followers of the fire God). They too leave their dead for the Vultures to eat.....Their reasoning is that - even if a person is dead he should be able to help another creature - in this case by satisfying the vultures hunger... http://tessy-george.blogspot.com/ |
| 17th September 2007 MaryC | Read 'Sky Burial' by Xinran - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I've just finished reading the non-fiction novel 'Sky Burial' by Xinran and would recommend it to anyone who has found this discussion on sky burials interesting (or infuriating, or whatever). Xinran introduces the reader to Tibetan culture in a very personal and accessible way, and sky burial is central to the story she shares. I got the book from Amazon. |
| 14th September 2007 R Eldar | To Kirra - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I know all about the suffering in Tibet, and if you read some of my other blogs from Tibet you will see that I did tag them under Tibet and not under China, and I also mentioned the suffering and the harsh history of the place. This specific event, though, took place in mainland China and not in Tibet. It was practiced by Tibetans that live in China. |
| 5th September 2007 kt | FREE TIBET - From: Tibetan sky burial in China As the Tibetans have suffered under chinese rule and invasion, would you consider changing the title to "Tibetan sky burial in TIBET" and change the flag to the TIBETAN FLAG? - it is off topic, but do you know that Tibetans are imprisoned and often tortured if caught with a photo of the His Holiness the Dalai Lama? |
| 1st September 2007 Jess | I'd like to be "buried" this way - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I think this is really a great, eco-sensitive way of getting "back to the Earth". I'd much rather be taken care of this way than to have my remains rot in a box or be burned to a cinder. |
| 19th July 2007 Kirra Tara | my thoughts - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Tashi delek!! a few days ago 3 Jokhang Monks took me to witness a sky burial at Drigung Monastery.... As Buddhists give everything, a sky burial is a last offering of ones self, giving their body for food, I think it is similar to donating your organs/body parts to save lives... Tibetans believe you remain in the body for 3 days after death, and then you are completely gone.. Similar to us humans sitting around a big plate of meat really... think about it.. thanks for sharing your story and pics |
| 18th June 2007 Muzna | Fortunate - From: Tibetan sky burial in China You are very fortunate indeed to have witnessed such a ritual. Thank you for sharing your thoughts/feelings and photos. |
| 8th June 2007 Snowfrake | have some fucking respect - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I know you've had a lot of comments, and I never write comments in blogs but I feel the need to tell you how ashamed I am in some so-called travellers like you. Most of my resentment of this blog has been expressed by others. I especially agree with Anna, who asked if you have had a family member die. Immagine if at your cousin's/father's/ sister's funeral some "accomplished traveler" comes by, asks someone besides you if they could take pictures (and they say yes because they are feeling vulnerable), and then procedes to pose infront of your deceased family member. And the fact that you were LOOKING for this, it seems that you didnt want to learn about it, but just take pictures so you can boast in your blog how cultured you are! I'd like to learn about funerals too. Let me know when your aunt dies, I'd like to post it on my blog along with pictures... |
| 13th May 2007 Andy | Thumbs up - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Thank you for your powerful writing in this the picures. I was there in 2006 and took some photos. I had to donate some money to the family and the monk for that. andy_ino@yahoo.com.au I would liketo swap photos if you would Thanks |
| 26th April 2007 Anna | Show some respect - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Hi! I have no problem with the things you witnessed, I have heard a lot about sky burials before. I don't even have a problem with your descriptions, after all there are many people who are interested to learn.... BUT to put photographs on the internet?! Even just to take pictures. Did the family actually speak enough English to say you could take photos and explain why they were happy with it, or did they just nod when you pointed to your camera. Did they have any idea the images would be put on the internet for everyone to see? You have no right to intrude on people's private grief in such a way. Even if they gave you permission to be there you should have more respect for the deceased than to take photos of the corpse. Have you never had anyone close to you die... would you have liked tourists at their funeral? How would you feel if you came across photographs of a dead relatives body on the internet? As for the last photo.... you're sick! That's not a tourist attraction behind you! That is a private religious ceremony and you're posing as if you've found yet another historic monument! And as for taking photographs of the grieving relatives.... well I hope next time you're at a funeral there's someone there snapping a flash at you. You should be ashamed of yourself. |
| 16th March 2007 lottae | ahhhhh - From: Tibetan sky burial in China wowo coollll |
| 21st February 2007 Silk | Great Resource - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I'm a Sociology student at a small American university, and I've been researching burial practices for a few years now. This page and your photographs are a treasure trove of primary research, you really should write up your experiences and publish what you saw for the benefit of the academic community. I've had a very difficult time in the past finding legitimate research materials on Sky Burial specifically, and excarnation in general. Sources like your experience are invaluable to social research. Thanks for sharing. |
| 2nd February 2007 Greg | Not really so wierd - From: Tibetan sky burial in China If you put this into a cultural and religious context this custom is really not so strange after all. Buddhists believe that all life is connected, and death is just another step on the circular wheel of life. I see this as a beautiful and symbolic practice. It seems much more in tune with nature and "reality" than some of our Western funeral customs. |
| 31st January 2007 anonymous | - From: Tibetan sky burial in China Can you show us some photograps of your dead mother, please? |
| 20th January 2007 anonymous | Thank you - From: Tibetan sky burial in China I feel that you told the story respectfully, and that the photos were not "over the top" in any way. If people hear about some type of tradition or ceremony, and it is shrouded in secrecy and spoken of in whispers, and shielded from view....that is what creates misunderstandings and stigma...you've helped us to understand this ritual.... we will probably never have the opportunity to travel and see these things; it's great that there are people willing to share... especially since you were invited to join the family and were allowed to take photos.... may this person rest in peace. I was moved by this story....thank you. |
